E&OE TRANSCRIPT
Topics: Prac payments program, Pauline Hanson on domestic violence, rural and regional health sector.
HOST, RAF EPSTEIN: To speak about that and other issues, Ged Kearney is the Assistant Minister for the Prevention of Family Violence and a Labor MP in Melbourne, the seat of Cooper in Melbourne's north. Good morning, Ged Kearney.
GED KEARNEY, ASSISTANT MINISTER: Good morning, Raf.
RAF EPSTEIN: Why is the Government doing this, and can you afford to do it?
GED KEARNEY: Well, I think it's a question of can we afford not to do this. These are critical, absolutely crucial professions, I think you would agree, mostly in the health sector.
We have trialled it, if you like, with midwives and nursing and social workers, and as a nurse myself for 20 years, I absolutely get why we're doing it.
If you are a student nurse or a student midwife or a student in any of these other careers, you know, you probably have a part‑time job, a casual job like most students, but then when you do clinical placements it could be in a block of say two weeks, 10 weeks, maybe even 12 weeks, and you might even have to go to the country, you might have to go to Warrnambool or Echuca or Shepparton to do that placement, which is a good thing 'cause you get a taste for working in the rural and regional areas, and we need workers there.
So what happens is you have to give up your part‑time job because you do full‑time hours, you might do late shifts, morning shifts, you can't hold down basically two jobs, one of which unfortunately you don't get paid for, but you still have all those bills.
So a lot of students might think, "Well, look, I just can't afford to do this", they might drop out from that course, it's really, really financially a burden on them, and this means that more people will stay in those courses, they'll complete their courses and they'll still be able to pay the rent and put some food on the table while they do that.
This is a great announcement by the Prime Minister today, and I'm really proud of it actually.
RAF EPSTEIN: Why is the Government paying; like shouldn't the universities pay? It's their degree, right? They get a lot of money from the student and the Government, the unis pay for the other parts of learning, why shouldn't they ‑ why are they not paying this?
GED KEARNEY: Well, you know, that's a good question, I guess, but the universities do pay, sometimes they have to pay the hospitals or the institutions where they put the students, they have to pay for the teachers, that's clinically supervise the students while they're in those placements.
The Government has decided this is a good investment for the country, a good investment, because it means we will get highly skilled, good, qualified health practitioners right across the board, and it might mean that a few more of those will go to rural and regional areas which is often when the greatest burden or financial burden happens for these kids.
RAF EPSTEIN: Ged Kearney is part of Anthony Albanese's team, she's an MP here in Melbourne and an Assistant Minister as well.
Just before I get to some of the One Nation comments, Ged Kearney, there's a cost to this to the Federal Government. You've been around for a little while, not insulting you there, we're both of a particular generation. Does debt not matter anymore, like is that not an issue in politics anymore?
GED KEARNEY: That it costs something, Raf, yes, of course it is. I mean when you're in government it's about priorities, isn't it, and you've got to sit down as a government and work out what is our priority a right now. And we know that the health workforce, you speak to anyone who works in the health sector right across the board, workforce, workforce, workforce is the main thing that they talk about. How do we recruit, how do we train, how do we retain those workers? And I don't think anybody listening would disagree that investing in the health workforce is a good investment, and it should be a priority.
RAF EPSTEIN: And people who miss out, so I'm getting examples of teachers of English as a second language, veterinarians, others, there's a tonne of people who do training that don't get this payment. What do you say to those who won't get this help?
GED KEARNEY: Well, as you say, you know, we're starting with the health workforce, and I think this is a good place to start, and I hear it from those other professions. But here we are, we've expanded it from three, another 10 have been expanded. Let's see how that goes, Raf.
RAF EPSTEIN: Ged Kearney, we spoke last week a lot about four women and girls killed in four days, that's now, I think, close to three weeks ago that terrible four‑day period.
Yesterday Pauline Hanson was on commercial radio in Brisbane. She was asked about domestic violence, and I just want to play this to everyone. Here's Pauline Hanson on 4BC, where she said that domestic violence is a two‑way street.
[Excerpt]
PAULINE HANSON: Well, it is wrong, but it's also a two‑way street, but I'm not saying that it's just men, women can lose their cool as well.
[End of Excerpt]
RAF EPSTEIN: Ged Kearney, a lot of people might hear that and agree with it. What would you say?
GED KEARNEY: Oh, Raf. You know, as someone who's been a nurse and has seen firsthand the results of domestic violence and women coming into Emergency Departments or presenting to the health sector around it, to working in the sector now as a responsible Minister and working with the sector who have worked so, so hard to actually change that irresponsible and dangerous rhetoric that Pauline Hanson is putting out, and she's in a responsible position, she has a voice, and all of us have been trying to send a message to victim survivors that this is not their fault, and let's face it, 94 per cent of perpetrators are men, and you know, the vast majority of people who die at the hands of domestic violence perpetrators are women, as you said in your opening, and we have been working so hard.
And I've got to congratulate you, Raf, because you have been really highlighting this issue. You have a voice, and you have been using it effectively to say to victim survivors, "This is not your fault, we know you need help, you can't just up and leave if you have kids, you have no income, you have no house to go to, you have no means to escape that situation, that we are working hard to help you." And then along comes Senator Hanson, who just goes back to that old trope, you know, that blaming the victim/survivors as much as the perpetrators.
This is really dangerous. And saying women should just leave ‑‑
RAF EPSTEIN: Dangerous?
GED KEARNEY: I think it's dangerous, because it takes us back to a point where, you know, it minimises ‑ it makes it less of an issue than it really is. This is a huge issue, this is a crisis right now in this country, and as a government, we are working incredibly hard to help women leave. It takes enormous courage, it takes safety planning, it takes financial support, it takes a lot of people, and there's a lot of great people out there in the sector I know who work hard every single day.
And as the Minister responsible for this area, I, I can categorically say that we are taking this very seriously, and we want victim survivors to know it's not their fault and Pauline Hanson is turning all of that on their head, and saying, you know, victim blaming essentially. You know, one of the most dangerous times for a woman is when she decides to leave.
RAF EPSTEIN: Yes.
GED KEARNEY: We know all the statistics show that.
RAF EPSTEIN: Okay.
GED KEARNEY: That moment that she wants to walk out the door is extremely dangerous, and it's often when women are killed.
RAF EPSTEIN: Why doesn't Pauline Hanson suffer in the polls when she says things that if other politicians said them, you feel the polls would drastically drop; why doesn't that happen to her?
GED KEARNEY: Well, maybe it does. You know, I've got to say, Raf, I think there are a lot of women out there, a lot of people who work in the sector who might have been flirting with Pauline Hanson, but I can tell you now, if you are a parent of a daughter who's had to come home to your house because she's suffered at the hands of an intimate partner, or if you are a woman who has fled, or if you are someone who is thinking of levering right now, I reckon this would make you think twice about voting for Pauline Hanson.
RAF EPSTEIN: Nothing she says seems to stop her poll rise.
GED KEARNEY: Nothing she says seems to stop her, I think. But I think this will have ‑ you know, personally, I think this really steps over the line, and my message to all the women out there is that this Government is working incredibly hard for you. We've invested more than $4 billion in family domestic and sexual violence.
You know, we have [indistinct] making payments to women who are trying to leave, we have increased the frontline workforce by 500 workers, you know, we are investing a lot of money in First Nations communities to try to stem the tide of family domestic violence in First Nations communities.
You know, we are doing a great deal, as much, I think, as any government can do, and more than any other government before to work with the wonderful people in the sector, the great advocates to keep women and children safe.
RAF EPSTEIN: Thanks for your time this morning.
GED KEARNEY: My pleasure. Thanks Raf.
RAF EPSTEIN: That's Ged Kearney, she's the Assistant Minister for the prevention of family violence. Worth pointing out when Pauline Hanson says women should leave, Anglicare was saying yesterday, the immediate cost of leaving an abusive relationship, on average more than $7,000, so the woman would need that much on hand just to leave.
So covered a fair bit there with Ged Kearney, those comments from Pauline Hanson, the increased prac payments.